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    our daughter(not a witness) has married her girlfriend. we are sad but do not knoww if we should avoid her should we

    email grammabarb8@att.net

    +5  Views: 1103 Answers: 19 Posted: 13 years ago
    Bob/PKB

    SO.... after all this input, what are you thinking?
    Colleen

    Moderator
    tita1, how can children or anyone with an open mind accept bible principles when the principles you speak of do not exist? They are made up principles based on the misinterpretation of 2 small verses. 1 in the OT which got changed/altered in the NT. I can hardly wait for the next revision of the bible to see just how the other "principles" change. It seems to me that people need to catch up with what the truth is. Barbara's daughter is living her truth. It's misinformed people like you who want to make it a lie. Gays exist because God loves them yet you two can not emulate this God you supposedly love and love his creations also. I feel sorry for you and Barbara because you've let the lies of men override your heart and make you dislike people that God Himself created. How do you suppose you make God feel by being this way?
    Vinny

    Good comment Colleen..
    carmaxable

    here we go again. just live and let live, people!

    19 Answers

    I know JVW. do not accept  gay people. But if you believe that God has created us all, you have to believe that your daughter was born that way, all of them are. To disown her for the way she is, would be a sin and would cause great pain for youself and your daughter. There is a great bond between a mother and child, that no one and no relgion schould be able to break.

    itsmee

    I love what you said, Ann.
    Colleen

    Moderator
    @ tita1, Neither the bible nor God are against homosexuality. Moses is the old testament where anal sex was listed as an abomination. Abomination and sin are two different things. Abomination was moral code, a list of laws for the people that man put together according to what he cherry picked from the OT and then expanded apon with his own ideas. Sin applies to breaking the Christian God's laws. Neither the OT nor the NT says anything about Gays or lesbians. They only mention anal sex and that man shall not lie down with another man. Big whoop. They were trying to populate the earth back then. That was a man made law, not a God law, and I don't care if some man put it in the bible as God said it, that man lied. God never said such a thing. A bigoted man did. God is not a bigot, men are. The word homosexual did not exist until the 1860's when it was invented so what is it doing in a book that was written 2000 years ago? Yup, the agenda of man to persecute something THEY, not God, do not like. Homosexuality became a sin in the New Testament, an upgrade from the Old Testament's view of it only being an abomination. A breaking of moral code for their era. Suddenly in this century, it is changed to sin and included in the New Testament when it wasn't there before. Do you think God added that part after the fact? Your book was not written by God but by men with agendas and it continues to be rewritten to fit the agenda of evil church leaders. Why did homosexuality go from being an abomination in the Old Testament to a sin in the revised edition that came out this century? Before this century, anal sex (not homosexuality) was an abomination. Now all of a sudden, homosexual is a word in the bible and it's a sin. WHO put that in there? Did God come down one day and edit the bible? Who played God and added that bit to a book that is suppose to be the word of God but keeps getting revised and changed? Why should the word of God need revising? Both testaments mention anal sex but they also mention sex out of wedlock and masturbation as being abominations or sins depending on the bible version you read. How many good Christians commit the latter two abominations/sins while looking down their pious nose at homosexuals? Neither books say it's against God to love the same gender. So now YOU read the books because I can bet you've never read either one. You're just parroting words that bigots took out of context. Priests today are not homos (a word that God loving people do not use because they recognize it as inflammatory and derogatory. God loving people do not make fun of others). The priests diddling little kids are pedophiles. Pedophilia has nothing to do with homosexuality. Go educate yourself so you stop making ignorant statements like this. God is not against the homosexuals, simpleminded people are. God does not hate, egotistical people hate. Stop blaming God for your short comings.
    Bob/PKB

    this is to tita 1: Did YOU read the BIBLE or did you read something written ABOUT the Bible?
    I've not read the entire Bible, but I have read the portion that covers Moses and have covered most of the new testament. I don't find references to the people you have mentioned in your comment.
    Making an all-inclusive statement about priests (or any body of people, for that matter) does not show a tremendous amount of knowledge or understanding.
    To me, it appears you need to do your own homework.

    Loving your daughter does not mean accepting what you don't like. It means LOVE and that's what matters.


     

    No, you should not avoid your daughter. You are not obligated to like the life she has chosen, but, respect and accept it's your daughter's life, not yours.

    carmaxable

    amen. hate the sin, but love the sinner.
    IamPamela313

    The absolute truth! :-)
    Colleen

    Moderator
    It would be true if it were actually a sin. God Himself never labeled it a sin. Man did. Do you follow God or man? Read the history of your bible and how it was an abomination in the old testament but got changed to a sin after Christ had long since died in the new testament. Show me where Christ called it a sin. The bible only speaks of anal sex. Something that even straight people partake of and not all homosexuals practice. Does this mean that only some homosexuals are sinning? If two lesbians are not practicing anal sex, this means they should be loved fully and not have to have "love the sinner but hate the sin" stamped to their foreheads, correct?
    Definition of abomination http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/abomination, Nowhere in the definition does it mention God, of God or sin. Abomination was man made moral laws for their era.

    I have to say without judgement on my part that this is the saddest part of being a witness. No religion should tell you to shun your family, especially your daughter, because she has gone outside your religious belief system.It would be sad for her to be told she is no longer worth your love because she loves someone you disagree with, but most of all it would be your loss. Later in life when your very elderly you count on your love and support from your family. This is not your place to judge but instead to love.

    Flip

    Excellent answer Mom. Said without judgement, but stressing the importance of support and love. Exactly what I feel the parent was looking to hear. TU

    What does your heart say? i thought a parents love was unconditional.

    mom

    How true is that staement...amen

    Once your daughter, always your daughter.  Love her.  She will appreciate your love.

    Don't be silly....this is your daughter..let her marry whomever she wishes to...it is not your life....merely hers.....get on with it and don't have regrets years from now!

    What is wrong with you? Do you think your God will send you to hell for loving your daughter and accepting her life as SHE NEEDS TO LIVE IT? Stop thinking you can control another living being. God does not like close mindedness. Do you think he loves her any less than he loves you in all your close minded glory? Your daughter may actually be better off without you. You're useless to her if you continue to think the way you do.

    mom

    Wow, very well put Colleen.
    Bob/PKB

    I detect a little of the same attitude (?) I had with the question about mixed race w/ white the other day.
    It makes me sad when people condemn other people for their beliefs or marital choices (even women marrying known hired assassins are given more acceptance than homosexual marriages)
    Colleen

    Moderator
    That person also came back and verified that he/she is indeed Christian and wanted to make sure he/she didn't do something against God. This is not the same as that. That was about someone not understanding their religion. This is about someone not understanding that people are born homosexual because God created them to be homosexual and then they follow a religion that closes their mind to what God created because some man or men told them so. I see no similarities.

    My personal opinion of Jehovah's Witnesses is that they are following the teachings of a mortal who added conditions and stipulations and rituals found nowhere in the Bible and found some naive folks to fall for it. 
    God blessed you with a daughter.  She is from God and He made her perfect in His eyes. 
    Should you avoid her?  The question should be, based on what you've said here, "Should she avoid you?"


    Something tells me that she is far more compassionate than you and will keep you in her life. That would be a blessling, in case you're keeping track.

    sorry it still pisses me off that a parent could turn there backs on there children i have 7 and i dont care wat they do i will always b here for them at least till im gone

    Colleen

    Moderator
    You are a parent as a parent should be. You do not let others control your mind. You are a good man ;)
    carmaxable

    me too!

    If you expect your children to honor their parents, then at the very least you should set an example for them.  This society is already harsh on your daughter and her spouse.  If you alienate them now, who'd protect them, and in turn, when you grow old or become incapacitated, who'd take care of YOU?


    Remember the Golden Rule even within your own clan.  Love and be loved.  Protect and be protected.  Never forget she calls you "mom."


     


     

    Thank goodness God loves unconditionally to make up for people who can not understand or accept that love is love is love is love. It does not matter who you love, as long as you do love. So simple yet so hard for some people to comprehend. Why do religions create nonsense and then blame the nonsense on God?


     

    Bob/PKB

    Why do SOME religions create nonsense and then blame the nonsense on God?
    Colleen

    Moderator
    Sorry, I've seen nonsense in the Christian religion too. I will never say one should not follow the religion though.
    Bob/PKB

    I didn't specify any other religion on this. JW is the faith under discussion here. I did not point a finger at anyone else.
    Alot of people will just wave a hand at anything that doesn't go along with how they want to live and just call it religious nonsense. Does any faith outside of JW dictate disowning someone for being homosexual? I sure don't know of one. Do you?
    I'd love to be able to wave off such nonsense as sales tax, property taxes, income taxes, and be able to tell the grocer that the eggs I'm buying are worth 85 cents and that's all he's getting and be able to walk out with them. There are a lot of restrictions and conditions and "have-to" and "gotta" that I can't ignore. Religion is the least of my worries in that respect.
    It really is offensive and hurtful when you grind on the Christian religion and ignore others which don't line up with your beliefs (and there must be others out there). But, on the other hand, I'm glad you aren't running amok with your condemnation of religion... just seem to have a problem with Christianity, and that was before I showed up, so it has to be experiences you have endured. Just remember, Colleen, I, Bob/PKB have not criticized or belittled your beliefs or lifestyle, nor will you find me doing so.
    Colleen

    Moderator
    You have blinders on then. I've seen a lot of Christians say they would disown one of their kids because the bible does not condone homosexuality. It calls homosexuality sin now where once it was just an abomination and that was referring to anal sex, not the love part that comes along with being homosexual.

    I only replied to you because you made note of the word SOME by typing it in all caps. I assumed you wanted me to not include the Christian religion in my comment which I could not do. I did not grind on any particular religion. I said religions. I think you take anything I have to say to heart like I'm thinking of you when I comment. I am not thinking of you. I am thinking of people like pounder who said the bible says gays shall be put to death. http://www.akaqa.com/question/q19191522775-Petition-to-ban-gay-rights Instead of trying to straighten me out, try straightening out your fellow Christians.

    I have my say on any religion that puts out foolishness. The Christian religion and it's beliefs is the most posted about here though. Most followers get the religion wrong but they can't be faulted really, the religion itself with all it's many break off religions is confusing all on it's own. What other religion has so many parts of itself at war with each other as to who promotes the correct version of the bible?
    Bob/PKB

    I put SOME in all caps because your coment said, "Why do religions...." and I interpreted that as all-inclusive. My comment did not eliminate any particular religion. The return comment singled out Christianity.
    You will never get an argument from me as to the ridiculous number of tribes of Christians. I am not versed in all of them, but am sure I would find a human at the core of any one of them, adding something to what the Bible says, or interpreting a passage out of context. It would almost seem they were trying to take the glory FROM God, not give it TO Him.
    I'll try not to take things so personally... of all my many shortcomings, that is one of the most difficult for me to tame.

    Be grateful your daughter has someone who loves her and wants to share their life with her.

    Chiangmai

    Great answer.
    Bob/PKB

    Kudos. Right on ed shank.

    Bless all of you and your most thoughtful answers!!!....(:

    well i cant vote anymore daily limit reached mostly here lol but all your answers get a thumbs up from me

    Thank you all for your thoughtful comments. 


    I heard Lady Gaga joking on a late-night talk show. She said, "if one of my children grew up straight, I'd disown them!"


    I LOVE lady Gaga so I want to make sure you do truly understand she was JOKING. She is a pure soul who loves all of us.  I hope you get a chance to meet her (through the blue TV screen lights)  She's truly an athlete climbing around on her piano, singing her heart out and wearing six inch heels -- oh, the wonder that she is. <3  I worried that she'd fall and held my breath through her entire performance. 

    thank you colleen thank u muchly

    she is your blood i dont care wat your religion is i feel bad for you that you have such a closed mind and that your religion has the same closed mind i dont understand how one can turn there back on there blood but its ok for your preist to use little boys as sex toys. this infuriates me

    Colleen

    Moderator
    Actually, that would be the Catholics not JWs. I had to edit your comment a little ;)

    are we done yet? i love all of you-no matter what

    Yobo

    That's all that's needed to be said.


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