amfortas
Can I ask you, when straight people have anal sex with their opposite sex partner, is that being normally-sexual people?
Hi itsmee. I would say that 'normally sexual' people are the everyday heterosexual women who seek men as their object of desire for their sexual satisfaction, and heterosexual men who seek women likewise. It is 'normal' by virtue of proportion. Argue as one may about the exactitude, it is generally accepted from surveys, statistical analysis and simple everyday observation that non-heterosexual people constitute no more than 5% of the population while heterosexual people are 95%. I hope that answers your question.
Hi Colleen. My opinion regarding your question is that the vast majority of heterosexual people do not have anal sex as a general manner of intercourse. Many may try it, simply because it is possible, but when you look at the survey date, the statistical analysis and again, simple observation (talking to one's friends) it seems to be a 'try it and decide against doing it again' issue. That does not mean there are not a small percentage of people who do it more often, of course, but I am buggered if I can understand why! :)
Just why a woman would want anal sex is something that you might be better able to answer than I. As a woman's 'sexual pleasure' organ is the clitoris, it is best stimulated in situ rather than from any nearby orofice designed for passing things out of rather than accomodating inward traffic.
Just why a woman would want anal sex is something that you might be better able to answer than I. As a woman's 'sexual pleasure' organ is the clitoris, it is best stimulated in situ rather than from any nearby orofice designed for passing things out of rather than accomodating inward traffic.
How can I better answer why women have anal sex? I do not have anal sex nor do I have intercourse by any means. There is a heterosexual woman here on aka who does have anal sex and enjoys it. You might want to ask her.
I took some time to do a little research for you since it's apparent, you've not taken the time yourself.
Wiki-pedi: In a study of hetero anal sex (8/2010 (n=214)), female participants stated that stimulation to multiple erogenous zones simultaneously (the clitoris, the G-Spot, the anus, and other erogenous zones) enabled the woman to enjoy anal intercourse with much less discomfort compared to anal penetration by itself. Women who had orgasms during anal sex reported that an orgasm during anal sex was more of a full-body experience than an orgasm from just clitoral stimulation.[24]
Male to Male
Historically, anal sex has been commonly associated with male homosexuality. However, many men who have sex with men do not engage in anal sex.[1][25][60][61] Among men who have anal sex with other men, the insertive partner is called the top and the one being penetrated is called the bottom. Those who enjoy either role are referred to as versatile.[61][62][63] Gay men who prefer anal sex may view it as "[their] version of intercourse"[26] and as "the natural apex of sex, a wonderful expression of intimacy, and a great source of pleasure..."[60] Psychologist Walt Odets said, "I think that anal sex has for gay men the same emotional significance that vaginal sex has for heterosexuals."[64]
Some men who have sex with men prefer to engage in frot or other forms of mutual masturbation because they find it more pleasurable and/or more affectionate, to preserve technical virginity, or as safe sex alternatives to anal sex,[60][61][64][65][66][67] while other frot advocates denounce anal sex as degrading to the receptive partner and unnecessarily risky.[64][65][68][69]
In 1992, a study conducted by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention found that only 26% of men 18 to 59 and 20% of women 18 to 59 had engaged in heterosexual anal sex; a similar 2005 survey (also conducted by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention) found a rising incidence of anal sex relations in the American heterosexual population. The survey showed that 40% of men and 35% of women between 25 and 44 had engaged in heterosexual anal sex.[45] In terms of overall numbers of survey respondents, seven times as many women as gay men said that they engaged in anal intercourse, with this figure reflecting the larger heterosexual population size.[46]
So there you go. There's your normally sexual people. Considering heterosexuals practice what is perceived as homosexual sex, I'd say the homosexuals are normally sexual people too.
BTW, where did you get this "fact"?
"simple everyday observation that non-heterosexual people constitute no more than 5% of the population while heterosexual people are 95%."
You might want to research that Your made up percentage is way too low.
2002 Gallup poll. (The best I could find for now).
In August 2002*, Gallup asked Americans, in an open-ended format, to estimate the percentage of American men and the percentage of American women who are homosexual. The average estimates were that 21% of men are gay and 22% of women are lesbians. In fact, roughly a quarter of the public thinks more than 25% of men and 25% of women are homosexual. It should be pointed out, too, that many Americans (at least one in six) could not give an estimate.
So that was in 2002. Acceptance of homosexuality has risen steadily since then. This means more homosexuals have stepped out of their closets or left their false marriages to the opposite sex and are living their lives as they were born to live them. This would mean that if another Gallup poll was taken, I can bet the percentage would be higher now. So long as a great percentage of the population stands against homosexuality, we will never be able to get a true count because 100's of thousands of homosexuals remain hidden and living false lives out of fear of being persecuted by the "normally sexuals".
I took some time to do a little research for you since it's apparent, you've not taken the time yourself.
Wiki-pedi: In a study of hetero anal sex (8/2010 (n=214)), female participants stated that stimulation to multiple erogenous zones simultaneously (the clitoris, the G-Spot, the anus, and other erogenous zones) enabled the woman to enjoy anal intercourse with much less discomfort compared to anal penetration by itself. Women who had orgasms during anal sex reported that an orgasm during anal sex was more of a full-body experience than an orgasm from just clitoral stimulation.[24]
Male to Male
Historically, anal sex has been commonly associated with male homosexuality. However, many men who have sex with men do not engage in anal sex.[1][25][60][61] Among men who have anal sex with other men, the insertive partner is called the top and the one being penetrated is called the bottom. Those who enjoy either role are referred to as versatile.[61][62][63] Gay men who prefer anal sex may view it as "[their] version of intercourse"[26] and as "the natural apex of sex, a wonderful expression of intimacy, and a great source of pleasure..."[60] Psychologist Walt Odets said, "I think that anal sex has for gay men the same emotional significance that vaginal sex has for heterosexuals."[64]
Some men who have sex with men prefer to engage in frot or other forms of mutual masturbation because they find it more pleasurable and/or more affectionate, to preserve technical virginity, or as safe sex alternatives to anal sex,[60][61][64][65][66][67] while other frot advocates denounce anal sex as degrading to the receptive partner and unnecessarily risky.[64][65][68][69]
In 1992, a study conducted by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention found that only 26% of men 18 to 59 and 20% of women 18 to 59 had engaged in heterosexual anal sex; a similar 2005 survey (also conducted by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention) found a rising incidence of anal sex relations in the American heterosexual population. The survey showed that 40% of men and 35% of women between 25 and 44 had engaged in heterosexual anal sex.[45] In terms of overall numbers of survey respondents, seven times as many women as gay men said that they engaged in anal intercourse, with this figure reflecting the larger heterosexual population size.[46]
So there you go. There's your normally sexual people. Considering heterosexuals practice what is perceived as homosexual sex, I'd say the homosexuals are normally sexual people too.
BTW, where did you get this "fact"?
"simple everyday observation that non-heterosexual people constitute no more than 5% of the population while heterosexual people are 95%."
You might want to research that Your made up percentage is way too low.
2002 Gallup poll. (The best I could find for now).
In August 2002*, Gallup asked Americans, in an open-ended format, to estimate the percentage of American men and the percentage of American women who are homosexual. The average estimates were that 21% of men are gay and 22% of women are lesbians. In fact, roughly a quarter of the public thinks more than 25% of men and 25% of women are homosexual. It should be pointed out, too, that many Americans (at least one in six) could not give an estimate.
So that was in 2002. Acceptance of homosexuality has risen steadily since then. This means more homosexuals have stepped out of their closets or left their false marriages to the opposite sex and are living their lives as they were born to live them. This would mean that if another Gallup poll was taken, I can bet the percentage would be higher now. So long as a great percentage of the population stands against homosexuality, we will never be able to get a true count because 100's of thousands of homosexuals remain hidden and living false lives out of fear of being persecuted by the "normally sexuals".
I challenge the factoid that 100's of thousands of homosexuals are hidden through 'fear' of persecution. Our society extols the 'virtues' of queerdom (their term) and we have laws that prohibit actions against them.
As for Gallop. that is a self-chosen answering poll and not a scientific or statistical survey. Try census date given confidentially. only 1.7% give their sexual preferences a homosexual. That seems to hold true for most western nations. Even if it were 25% it would still be a minority and as such not representative of 'average'.
Wiki is not an authority. It is largely edited by 'interested' people who have a tendancy to push a barrow, just as you appear to be doing, m'dear.
Your CDC statistics seems to confirm what I said, or at least not disconfirm it. That is to say, people may well try it but the numbers in the survey do not indicate what percentage do anal sex as a regular practice.
Thank you for responding nevertheless.
As for Gallop. that is a self-chosen answering poll and not a scientific or statistical survey. Try census date given confidentially. only 1.7% give their sexual preferences a homosexual. That seems to hold true for most western nations. Even if it were 25% it would still be a minority and as such not representative of 'average'.
Wiki is not an authority. It is largely edited by 'interested' people who have a tendancy to push a barrow, just as you appear to be doing, m'dear.
Your CDC statistics seems to confirm what I said, or at least not disconfirm it. That is to say, people may well try it but the numbers in the survey do not indicate what percentage do anal sex as a regular practice.
Thank you for responding nevertheless.
"we have laws that prohibit actions against them."
I was speaking world wide. Homosexuals exist in every country on every populated island in the world. Some countries still kill homosexuals legally.
The "laws" you speak of do not stop the negative words hurled at homosexuals. It does not protect them from being killed for being homosexual. It does not erase the hate homosexuals face every day. It does not take away the stigmatisms still affecting our community. Yes, around the world people remain hidden so they can escape the intolerance and bigotry.
"Even if it were 25% it would still be a minority and as such not representative of 'average'."
So? Does this mean they are less human and not worthy of rights? No poll is perfect. I can go and find another to depute your poll. The fact is, I am a lesbian and very active in my community. I have more information in this than you do. You will find every way you can to minimize the actual amount of gays in the world to try and prove...I'm not even sure what......what exactly are you trying to prove?
I think you need to go out into the world and start interviewing people on their sexual habits instead of burying your head in the sand and going "lalalalalala, I don't want to hear it". More straight people engage in anal sex than homosexuals do. Whether they keep with it does not matter because not all gays keep with it either.
Have you ever gone to school to study the homosexual life to make any kind of informed or knowledgeable comments about it? Or are you reading only write ups by other know nothings who oppose the life?
I was speaking world wide. Homosexuals exist in every country on every populated island in the world. Some countries still kill homosexuals legally.
The "laws" you speak of do not stop the negative words hurled at homosexuals. It does not protect them from being killed for being homosexual. It does not erase the hate homosexuals face every day. It does not take away the stigmatisms still affecting our community. Yes, around the world people remain hidden so they can escape the intolerance and bigotry.
"Even if it were 25% it would still be a minority and as such not representative of 'average'."
So? Does this mean they are less human and not worthy of rights? No poll is perfect. I can go and find another to depute your poll. The fact is, I am a lesbian and very active in my community. I have more information in this than you do. You will find every way you can to minimize the actual amount of gays in the world to try and prove...I'm not even sure what......what exactly are you trying to prove?
I think you need to go out into the world and start interviewing people on their sexual habits instead of burying your head in the sand and going "lalalalalala, I don't want to hear it". More straight people engage in anal sex than homosexuals do. Whether they keep with it does not matter because not all gays keep with it either.
Have you ever gone to school to study the homosexual life to make any kind of informed or knowledgeable comments about it? Or are you reading only write ups by other know nothings who oppose the life?
Colleen, m'dear, I sought your opinion on anal sex from a woman's perspective, because you are a woman. I am not and therefore sought your better knowledge. But you seem to castigate me for that even though you declare that you are as ignorant as I am.
If you wish to speak about the entire world and its 7 billion poeople and myriad cultures, then you must also allow that their chosen paths are theirs to determine and not yours or mine to interfere with. I can take some small responsibility for my own country and culture, via which I have some small voice. I, and you, do not have a voice in the treatment of any other nation's people by their people on behalf of their own beliefs and practices.
Personally I do not discriminate against homosexuals. They however do seem to discriminate against me, in that I am forbidden even to criticise them and can be labelled 'homophobic' or 'hate criminal' simply for not approving of sodomy / buggery. My approval, of course, is quite unecessary.
I do not see homosexuals as less than human. I do not see 'rights' as being involved at any level.
Have I been to school? Why yes. I have a Masters of Science in Psychology. I have 25 years experience in interviewing people about their sexual proclivities. How about you? Being a lesbian is not a professional qualification in Australia. Perhaps you can point to the country which recognises lesbianism as anything more than one minor sexual abberation. I do hold an educated, professional opinion on the matter, and can distinguish between 'the singer and the song'. I suspect that you have an ax to grind and some small bias perhaps. Forgive me if I am wrong.
If you wish to speak about the entire world and its 7 billion poeople and myriad cultures, then you must also allow that their chosen paths are theirs to determine and not yours or mine to interfere with. I can take some small responsibility for my own country and culture, via which I have some small voice. I, and you, do not have a voice in the treatment of any other nation's people by their people on behalf of their own beliefs and practices.
Personally I do not discriminate against homosexuals. They however do seem to discriminate against me, in that I am forbidden even to criticise them and can be labelled 'homophobic' or 'hate criminal' simply for not approving of sodomy / buggery. My approval, of course, is quite unecessary.
I do not see homosexuals as less than human. I do not see 'rights' as being involved at any level.
Have I been to school? Why yes. I have a Masters of Science in Psychology. I have 25 years experience in interviewing people about their sexual proclivities. How about you? Being a lesbian is not a professional qualification in Australia. Perhaps you can point to the country which recognises lesbianism as anything more than one minor sexual abberation. I do hold an educated, professional opinion on the matter, and can distinguish between 'the singer and the song'. I suspect that you have an ax to grind and some small bias perhaps. Forgive me if I am wrong.
"I sought your opinion on anal sex from a woman's perspective, because you are a woman. I am not and therefore sought your better knowledge."
In order to believe this, you had to assume I had and enjoyed anal sex. That's overly presumptuous on your part. That of course would put me on the defense. You seem to have learned the psych tricks better than anything else.
"I am forbidden even to criticise them"
If you do not discriminate, what is there to criticize them for? The fact they fight for their rights? Refuse to live in a closet? Have sex in the manner that they like best?
"I, and you, do not have a voice in the treatment of any other nation's people by their people on behalf of their own beliefs and practices."
The UN differs with you on this.
"I have a Masters of Science in Psychology"
I do too. Anyone can make such a claim on the internet.
I have spent 30 years of my life discussing homosexuality with homosexuals. Getting their interpretations and finding that the true homosexual and not the one simply hiding or experimenting in the life is born to be homosexual. I've been in 3 relationships which means I've had sex with other lesbians and know their sexual preferences personally. No book learning can compete with personal experience. I have an axe to grind with any person who feels we are like the zoo animals. Something to be studied and prodded and made different from the rest of the animals because it's difficult for them to accept that God created different for a reason. I've dealt with your kind for 30 years. I think you try to disguise your prejudice by trying to diagnose the homosexual.
In order to believe this, you had to assume I had and enjoyed anal sex. That's overly presumptuous on your part. That of course would put me on the defense. You seem to have learned the psych tricks better than anything else.
"I am forbidden even to criticise them"
If you do not discriminate, what is there to criticize them for? The fact they fight for their rights? Refuse to live in a closet? Have sex in the manner that they like best?
"I, and you, do not have a voice in the treatment of any other nation's people by their people on behalf of their own beliefs and practices."
The UN differs with you on this.
"I have a Masters of Science in Psychology"
I do too. Anyone can make such a claim on the internet.
I have spent 30 years of my life discussing homosexuality with homosexuals. Getting their interpretations and finding that the true homosexual and not the one simply hiding or experimenting in the life is born to be homosexual. I've been in 3 relationships which means I've had sex with other lesbians and know their sexual preferences personally. No book learning can compete with personal experience. I have an axe to grind with any person who feels we are like the zoo animals. Something to be studied and prodded and made different from the rest of the animals because it's difficult for them to accept that God created different for a reason. I've dealt with your kind for 30 years. I think you try to disguise your prejudice by trying to diagnose the homosexual.
Colleen says: "I've dealt with your kind for 30 years. I think you try to disguise your prejudice by trying to diagnose the homosexual."
"My Kind", Colleen? Are you stereotyping me?
I have displayed no prejudice at all in these posts, m'dear. I have no problem with anyone due their sexual proclivity, creed, colour, race or choice of tartan.
Their behaviour however is a matter I am able to have an opinion about. I could claim that stealing, mugging and rape are all 'natural' too, but I would hold a bit short of blaming God for them. Frankly if homosexuals want to put their penises in one another's bums, they can do it in private and not ask me to approve of it.
I do, however resent being lectured to.
Lastly, I do not make a false or flippant claim to my academic qualifications. They were all worked hard for. I am not noted amongst my aquaintances for telling lies to make an impression on strangers whom I am unlikely ever to meet. Perhaps you mix with people who do that.
"My Kind", Colleen? Are you stereotyping me?
I have displayed no prejudice at all in these posts, m'dear. I have no problem with anyone due their sexual proclivity, creed, colour, race or choice of tartan.
Their behaviour however is a matter I am able to have an opinion about. I could claim that stealing, mugging and rape are all 'natural' too, but I would hold a bit short of blaming God for them. Frankly if homosexuals want to put their penises in one another's bums, they can do it in private and not ask me to approve of it.
I do, however resent being lectured to.
Lastly, I do not make a false or flippant claim to my academic qualifications. They were all worked hard for. I am not noted amongst my aquaintances for telling lies to make an impression on strangers whom I am unlikely ever to meet. Perhaps you mix with people who do that.
17 Answers
ed shank
Show me a group of people who haven't been vilified by another group for their religion, color, political beliefs, nationality, sexual preference. We're human, we hate what we don't understand, we've hated it yesterday, today, and will tomorrow. I promise.
| 13 years ago. Rating: 13 | |
Well now there's an excellent reason to continue the hate. Fred Phelps should use this for his next protest at a dead soldier's funeral. Or the funeral of a 6 year old girl killed because some nut job was trying to off a congresswoman. Yes, people should continue to promote the hate agenda, by all means.
Tell me what your reading into my comment on this question. Explain to me PLEASE the hate you think I'm promoting. Read it again, and again if you don't get my point. It is the exact opposite of what your implying.
"We're human, we hate what we don't understand, we've hated it yesterday, today, and will tomorrow. I promise."
I was jumping off from the I promise part. You are promising the hate will continue. I was just saying because of the promise, that's an excellent way to keep it going. You did not specify you were against it.
I was jumping off from the I promise part. You are promising the hate will continue. I was just saying because of the promise, that's an excellent way to keep it going. You did not specify you were against it.
If the words "I promise" were replaced with the word "Guaranteed" would that do. We haven't changed since the beginning of time, why should we think tomorrow we will be different. That was my point.
But we are changing. Homosexuals are being accepted more and more as a people who simply love differently than others. States are recognizing the civil rights of the homosexuals. World wide, nations are recognizing the same. Hate is being eradicated. It's the slow ones who are having trouble catching up with the idea that God never intended for hate to be so strong in this world or have the foothold that it has.
I understand your point ed,there will always be hate,there will always be some sort of entity or group that will be hated on,that's never going to change.Very honest point,this is reality.
@Colleen, Society is becoming more accepting of alternative lifestyles, but we have a looong way to go. Hopefully mankind proves me wrong.
Ed My comment was going to be very similiar to yours... People are ppl , love and hate are part of who we are. I dont think that hate will ever go away. It my be directed at something new but it is going to find a place in this world.
Well I'm not worried about the alternative lifestyles. Lifestyles are things that are chosen partying, playing sports, hanging out at the bar etc. My focus is equal rights for the homosexual life. Society is becoming more accepting of homosexuals and their life. Smart society has realized homosexuals are not a threat.
Now had I viewed your comment as off topic from the actual question as it is, I would have understood it better. Apologies for misunderstanding your intent.
Now had I viewed your comment as off topic from the actual question as it is, I would have understood it better. Apologies for misunderstanding your intent.
>>>Jenn, I believe your explanation below is not entirely accurate. Yes, ppl are ppl, but hate, like fear, is learned or acquired over time. For example, when my kids were very young, they weren't afraid of falling or skinning their knees. After tumbling a few times, they became fearful of a certain area of the house. Hence, the only way to combat the issue of fear or hate is to break the cycle and teaching us to embrace differences rather than fearing or hating them.....As a footnote, we are renting a house to a gay couple. I have learned that they are absolutely the best family for our property. They are clean, respectful, and kind to us, as well as being prompt with their rent payments. By far they are the best tenant we've ever had. We would rent our property out to another gay family in the future for sure.
Colleen says: "But we are changing. Homosexuals are being accepted more and more as a people who simply love differently than others".
In what way do homosexuals 'Love differently'? I can see from what they say and do that they have sexual intercourse differently, but are you implying that the terms are interchangeable? That love and sexual intercourse are the same?
In what way do homosexuals 'Love differently'? I can see from what they say and do that they have sexual intercourse differently, but are you implying that the terms are interchangeable? That love and sexual intercourse are the same?
Colleen
What special laws? Our activities are not against the law.
| 13 years ago. Rating: 7 | |
Marriage is a civil contract acknowledged by the state and federal governments. Holy Matrimony is the rite of your religion that frowns on anal sex. No all gays perform anal sex. Homosexuality is love also. Couples have sex when they can fit it in. Get your face out of our bedrooms.
Too funny. Marriage was, is, and always will be for the uniting of a man (male) and woman (female) as one spirit, and for appropriately procreating. If they want equal rights similar to a marriage, then they should call it something else, such as a union or partnership, with equal rights as a married couple. BTW, there is nothing in a marriage that prohibits certain sexual acts, as long as both people agree to it without duress.
"they should call it something else, such as a union or partnership, with equal rights as a married couple."
This does not work as New Jersey is finding out. They have legal unions with the same rights as marriage but no one understands legal unions so the rights are still being denied to couples who have the legal union license. Everyone understands marriage however.
Calling it something else, makes it a special right and has to be introduced to the state constitution as a special right. So you whine that we want a special right but it's people like you who make it a special right by trying to call it something else rather than an equal right.
This does not work as New Jersey is finding out. They have legal unions with the same rights as marriage but no one understands legal unions so the rights are still being denied to couples who have the legal union license. Everyone understands marriage however.
Calling it something else, makes it a special right and has to be introduced to the state constitution as a special right. So you whine that we want a special right but it's people like you who make it a special right by trying to call it something else rather than an equal right.
Obviously, everyone doesn't understand what marriage is or they wouldn't be trying to distort it into something it isn't. BTW I wasn't whining. I could care less what people choose to do as long as it doesn't affect my rights, for example, free speech.
Obviously the heterosexual community has a hard time grasping the concept of marriage.....50% divorce rate. Marriage, a civil contract joining to people together to coexist as partners in life (not purely for the purpose of procreation) sanctioned by the state, recognized and endorsed by the federal government.
btw, giving gays the right to marry, does not affect your rights at all. You still get to keep your marriage. I also did not attempt to take away your freedom of speech. You are free to whine that we are stepping on your prejudice toes.
btw, giving gays the right to marry, does not affect your rights at all. You still get to keep your marriage. I also did not attempt to take away your freedom of speech. You are free to whine that we are stepping on your prejudice toes.
Night night Colleen. Again, simply because some people don't realize what marriage is, has nothing to do with other people's civil rights. If someone is breaking civil right laws in NJ, then that is a whole separate matter, which has nothing to do with marriage.
Sweet dreams my dear.
Sweet dreams my dear.
Your attempt to just close the door in my face is juvenile. It has everything to do with the civil rights afforded to married people. Legal unions in New Jersey are suppose to be equal to the marriage rights in New Jersey. It's civil rights that are being denied. Pretended ignorance of the matter is lame and does nothing for your argument but does everything for my argument. Thanks. :)
If you are going to discuss an issue, then leave emotions out of it, and discuss the issue and not the person. Among other things, it gets in the way of being able to interpret what others are saying. You implied I was predudicial when I am anything but. It caused you to not understand I am showing you the only way the homosexual community is going to have the same rights as married people.
Minority groups, (yes homosexuals make up less than 1% of society) have to work to amend a traditional laws, not change them. So the only way it will work is to call them civil rights, not marriage.
So create a civil union law, or whatever they wish to call it, that affords the homosexual community the same rights as a marriage, if they so choose to do so. It should also include persons who choose not to be married, but wish to live together and care for one another. BTW, I was not shutting the door on our conversation, I was going to bed. I do have a life outside of this media format.
Minority groups, (yes homosexuals make up less than 1% of society) have to work to amend a traditional laws, not change them. So the only way it will work is to call them civil rights, not marriage.
So create a civil union law, or whatever they wish to call it, that affords the homosexual community the same rights as a marriage, if they so choose to do so. It should also include persons who choose not to be married, but wish to live together and care for one another. BTW, I was not shutting the door on our conversation, I was going to bed. I do have a life outside of this media format.
"If you are going to discuss an issue, then leave emotions out of it"
Sure thing dictator. This is me being emotionless. You keep my rights from me and now you keep my emotions from me. Go you.
"You implied I was predudicial "
You implied it when you went the route of gays wanting "special laws". That's what all the haters say. I repeat, gays want equal rights. Not special laws.
"yes homosexuals make up less than 1% of society"
Not factual. There's no real way of knowing the actual count because many homosexuals are still hiding. A lot are pretending to be straight and are in miserable marriages. They do not want to come out into a world filled with people who say negative things about them and keep their rights from them. So they live unhappy lives to make the selfish people happy. But I digress. The actual numbers are more like 10% of the population which equates to millions. Millions of people either living the way God created them or living the life selfish people have forced them into. Those selfish people will be responsible for their actions and they will pay for their selfishness. Karma does bite hard.
"So the only way it will work is to call them civil rights, not marriage. "
I repeat, this does not work. Marriage in the states that allow marriage IS working. Civil unions are not working. the good open minded heterosexuals can't seem to understand civil unions. So they continue to deny the civilly unionized (gee, is that how one would say it?) people their rights.Speak to your close minded hetero community and get them to open up and maybe then, your idea will work.
"I was not shutting the door on our conversation, I was going to bed"
Uh huh. Had I not said anything more, neither would you. I've had other people here do the same thing as way of getting the last word in and ending the conversation. I know the trick.
Lastly, when I speak about the life, I have all the kids in my mind. The young teens forced to struggle with something that is natural FOR THEM. These kids, some of whom choose to end their lives verses having to fight for their right to be in this world and be happy. Then there's the young adults like the 21 year old lesbian that Roger Willcoe and Umbriel have both been cruel too. Sick bigots spreading their sickness all over. I bet they even pick on the handicapped. People can not help how they were born. This is not a sin nor is it an affliction. This is a life and damn all the hater. I will continue fighting them like I've done my whole life. Do you see all the comments (some of them pretty nasty) that get and have gotten posted here? Think back over the months. Take all that and multiply times the number of haters out there in our society and know that this kind of crap is what homosexuals have to face on a daily bases. Then remember that if some of those god fearing people had their way, all homos would be killed. You try living it and see how calm you remain when ignorance rears it's head again. Now go be the emotionless righteous one. God made you a heterosexual. You have nothing to fight for. You can only be selfish now. You don't know what it's like to fight for rights. You've only ever had them. Sometimes I think I fight to call it marriage just to smack down the selfish people.
Sure thing dictator. This is me being emotionless. You keep my rights from me and now you keep my emotions from me. Go you.
"You implied I was predudicial "
You implied it when you went the route of gays wanting "special laws". That's what all the haters say. I repeat, gays want equal rights. Not special laws.
"yes homosexuals make up less than 1% of society"
Not factual. There's no real way of knowing the actual count because many homosexuals are still hiding. A lot are pretending to be straight and are in miserable marriages. They do not want to come out into a world filled with people who say negative things about them and keep their rights from them. So they live unhappy lives to make the selfish people happy. But I digress. The actual numbers are more like 10% of the population which equates to millions. Millions of people either living the way God created them or living the life selfish people have forced them into. Those selfish people will be responsible for their actions and they will pay for their selfishness. Karma does bite hard.
"So the only way it will work is to call them civil rights, not marriage. "
I repeat, this does not work. Marriage in the states that allow marriage IS working. Civil unions are not working. the good open minded heterosexuals can't seem to understand civil unions. So they continue to deny the civilly unionized (gee, is that how one would say it?) people their rights.Speak to your close minded hetero community and get them to open up and maybe then, your idea will work.
"I was not shutting the door on our conversation, I was going to bed"
Uh huh. Had I not said anything more, neither would you. I've had other people here do the same thing as way of getting the last word in and ending the conversation. I know the trick.
Lastly, when I speak about the life, I have all the kids in my mind. The young teens forced to struggle with something that is natural FOR THEM. These kids, some of whom choose to end their lives verses having to fight for their right to be in this world and be happy. Then there's the young adults like the 21 year old lesbian that Roger Willcoe and Umbriel have both been cruel too. Sick bigots spreading their sickness all over. I bet they even pick on the handicapped. People can not help how they were born. This is not a sin nor is it an affliction. This is a life and damn all the hater. I will continue fighting them like I've done my whole life. Do you see all the comments (some of them pretty nasty) that get and have gotten posted here? Think back over the months. Take all that and multiply times the number of haters out there in our society and know that this kind of crap is what homosexuals have to face on a daily bases. Then remember that if some of those god fearing people had their way, all homos would be killed. You try living it and see how calm you remain when ignorance rears it's head again. Now go be the emotionless righteous one. God made you a heterosexual. You have nothing to fight for. You can only be selfish now. You don't know what it's like to fight for rights. You've only ever had them. Sometimes I think I fight to call it marriage just to smack down the selfish people.
Well now, except for a few more misinterpreted comments towards me, that was stated much better. Thank you.
Whenever a person starts name calling or falsely judges a person, they lose credibility. Any wonder why you have such a hard time gaining support for your cause? Wonder why people will just shut you out? And then of course, they are the "bad" ones. Stick with discussing the issues and not the person and you will be surprised at how many more people you can get to side with your cause.
First off, me stating the homosexual's were guilty of promoting special laws isn't predudicial, it was meant as something they've been forced into. Another example is Richard Pimentel was guilty of being forced into going after employers and eventually the government to change discrimination against the disabled and create laws to aid people with disabilities.
He went through exactly what you are running into, (see the movie, The Music Within) and discovered the only way he was going to gain equal rights for A MINORITY group (whether 1 or 10% is still a minority) was not to change laws, but to create new equal rights laws. Was it easy? No. Did everyone agree to the new laws? No. Sometimes not even sections of government did. But it finally came to reality. If the homosexual community is ever going to gain what they want, then this is EXACTLY what they will need to do, and put up with the aftershocks from it. If they learn to drop the word, Marriage, they will find much more support for their cause.
Next, I don't disagree with any of your comments made about unfortunate homosexual discrimmination. And no, I haven't been privy to demeaning comments some others have made on here to you about your cause. I don't spend as much time on here as others. Intelligent and meaningful conversations don't include quickly judging a person and there isn't any excuse to verbally abuse anyone in a hurtful manner simply because someone doesn't agree with there point of view. I am sorry this happened to you.
"Millions of people either living the way God created them or living the life selfish people have forced them into."
I disagree with the first part of the statement, but not necessarily the second. There are people who believe God created those who would be his children, and the rest are just for his amuzement to suffer eternally. There isn't any documentation (or spiritual discernment) available to even to begin to justify this opinion.
On the same note, there isn't any evidence that God allows homosexuals to be born that way. However, there is plenty of evidence it occurs from a person's inability to correctly interpret natural human relationships, and is reinforced by, among other things, spiritual entities deluding their thinking with non stop propaganda.
I realize this is going to open up a whole new disagreement with you, and it will be difficult for me to prove it to you without hours of sessions of explaining all of the complex details involved in how a person becomes a homosexual. Each person is unique, but there are identifiable patterns, and is quite provable and changing back to heterosexual is achievable to those who wish to be treated. However, even when a person who has been trapped in a cult all of their lives comes to see the light of truth, often wishes to stay with the group. Many others just don't care to do the work, so I don't see how it would be beneficial to pursue this point any further, unless you want to. But it would have to be on a very personal level, and this is certainly not the place to do that.:)
So, again, in another attempt to make sure you understand that I am in support of your cause, I agree that people who wish to live together and care for one another should have the same legal rights as a male and female in marriage. Whether they are same sex, brother or sister, black and white, they should have equal access to the benefits that a married couple has. Onto other issues now. :)
Whenever a person starts name calling or falsely judges a person, they lose credibility. Any wonder why you have such a hard time gaining support for your cause? Wonder why people will just shut you out? And then of course, they are the "bad" ones. Stick with discussing the issues and not the person and you will be surprised at how many more people you can get to side with your cause.
First off, me stating the homosexual's were guilty of promoting special laws isn't predudicial, it was meant as something they've been forced into. Another example is Richard Pimentel was guilty of being forced into going after employers and eventually the government to change discrimination against the disabled and create laws to aid people with disabilities.
He went through exactly what you are running into, (see the movie, The Music Within) and discovered the only way he was going to gain equal rights for A MINORITY group (whether 1 or 10% is still a minority) was not to change laws, but to create new equal rights laws. Was it easy? No. Did everyone agree to the new laws? No. Sometimes not even sections of government did. But it finally came to reality. If the homosexual community is ever going to gain what they want, then this is EXACTLY what they will need to do, and put up with the aftershocks from it. If they learn to drop the word, Marriage, they will find much more support for their cause.
Next, I don't disagree with any of your comments made about unfortunate homosexual discrimmination. And no, I haven't been privy to demeaning comments some others have made on here to you about your cause. I don't spend as much time on here as others. Intelligent and meaningful conversations don't include quickly judging a person and there isn't any excuse to verbally abuse anyone in a hurtful manner simply because someone doesn't agree with there point of view. I am sorry this happened to you.
"Millions of people either living the way God created them or living the life selfish people have forced them into."
I disagree with the first part of the statement, but not necessarily the second. There are people who believe God created those who would be his children, and the rest are just for his amuzement to suffer eternally. There isn't any documentation (or spiritual discernment) available to even to begin to justify this opinion.
On the same note, there isn't any evidence that God allows homosexuals to be born that way. However, there is plenty of evidence it occurs from a person's inability to correctly interpret natural human relationships, and is reinforced by, among other things, spiritual entities deluding their thinking with non stop propaganda.
I realize this is going to open up a whole new disagreement with you, and it will be difficult for me to prove it to you without hours of sessions of explaining all of the complex details involved in how a person becomes a homosexual. Each person is unique, but there are identifiable patterns, and is quite provable and changing back to heterosexual is achievable to those who wish to be treated. However, even when a person who has been trapped in a cult all of their lives comes to see the light of truth, often wishes to stay with the group. Many others just don't care to do the work, so I don't see how it would be beneficial to pursue this point any further, unless you want to. But it would have to be on a very personal level, and this is certainly not the place to do that.:)
So, again, in another attempt to make sure you understand that I am in support of your cause, I agree that people who wish to live together and care for one another should have the same legal rights as a male and female in marriage. Whether they are same sex, brother or sister, black and white, they should have equal access to the benefits that a married couple has. Onto other issues now. :)
"that was stated much better."
Don't be patronizing.
"Whenever a person starts name calling or falsely judges a person, they lose credibility."
No, not always. This also depends on the other half of the conversation and what ignorant statement has been said. I'm really tired of people using this as a general all around win. Your ignorance keeps you from seeing that homosexuals are people too. And they love just as you heteros do. We are flesh and blood, emotions and feelings and we LOVE! That gives us every right to be MARRIED!
"First off, me stating the homosexual's were guilty of promoting special laws isn't predudicial"
THEY ARE NOT SPECIAL RIGHTS! THEY ARE EQUAL RIGHTS! To call them special rights is a prejudice statement. It is still making the claim that homosexuals are not as good as you and not deserving of your same right to be called MARRIED.
"homosexual's were guilty of promoting"
GUILTY?? You are judging!! I have not falsely judged you! You have proven my case that you are prejudice.
"A MINORITY group (whether 1 or 10% is still a minority) was not to change laws, but to create new equal rights laws."
Gotta love how you force the separation by use of all caps, "A MINORITY". It does not matter how many we are...EQUAL RIGHTS FOR ALL!! It's in the Constitution and it's in the bill of rights! Do you know how the DMA and DADT got passed? Because the government walked all over the US Constitution and the Bill of Rights! I'm going to laugh at all of you when they take rights away from you that matter! You let them start it by ignoring the rights of others. You made them! You made the government that will eventually walk all over your rights too.
"I disagree with the first part of the statement"
Until you face the day that you are drawn to the same sex and there's nothing you can do about it or until you see the day when you can force yourself not to be drawn to the opposite sex, then you can disagree with the fact HOMOSEXUALS ARE BORN TO BE HOMOSEXUALS but I can guarantee if there was ever such a time or day, you would not then disagree! GOD made us this way! Just like He made you straight or did you do that all on your own by denouncing your gay self????
"On the same note, there isn't any evidence that God allows homosexuals to be born that way."
The evidence is right smack dab in your face!! I EXIST! GOD ALLOWS ME TO BE BORN THIS WAY! If He did not allow it, I'd be DEAD already! MILLIONS OF PEOPLE! A billion if you count world wide! We're not making it up! I've been single by choice for 11 years now. I'm still a lesbian! I love a woman just as you love a woman. Same, same. Can you stop? I know I can't.
"However, there is plenty of evidence it occurs from a person's inability to correctly interpret natural human relationships, and is reinforced by, among other things, spiritual entities deluding their thinking with non stop propaganda."
And this works for anyone who has never been gay. This works to appease their minds. This is not the answer. But it works for those who just can't accept without a damn good reason. Sex with a man makes my stomach turn. Yes, when I was 18-20, I gave the hetero life a fair shake. I found sex with a man revolting and I actually liked the guy. He treated me like the most perfect person in the world and I cared very much for him. But the relationship and the sex was not natural for me! I just was not attracted to him that way even though I tried to make myself be. I've never found a man in all my 49 years that I just had to be with like I just have to be with a woman. I found my naturally correct relationship with women! When you heteros stop throwing away marriage for flings or stupid reason, then you heteros can preach proper relationships! Now be happy, I've had to spill my life out here for all the world to see. Feel good? Do you feel in control by making me share shit that should be personal to me just to make you see how WRONG you thinking is?? YES! Sanctimonious pompous people get me riled!
"it will be difficult for me to prove it to you without hours of sessions of explaining all of the complex details involved in how a person becomes a homosexual."
You are not gay! How can you possibly know what it's all about? What exactly does a know nothing about the life have as proof?? I am a lesbian! I know myself and I know what I feel and I know I've always felt this way! Out of 8 children, I am the only one who turned out gay! Where do my siblings who live the same way I did, grew up the same way I did, got beat the same way I did, where do my siblings fit in your grand scheme as to what MAKES a homosexual?? My parents took my sexuality better than you. They know I was born this way. They knew even before I knew! What the heck do you know about being gay? NOTHING! You can not read gay and know all about it, you must live it to understand it!
"and is quite provable and changing back to heterosexual is achievable to those who wish to be treated."
HOMOSEXUALITY IS NOT A SICKNESS!! IT IS NOT A DISEASE!! STUPIDITY IS! Go get treated. The only people who "go back straight" are people who were always straight! They just played on our side of the fence for the thrill. I'd like to smack them all for ever claiming to be gay. They WERE NOT!
After that last comment from you I am done. You're an old dying breed. You do not support my cause, you support your cause of separate and fairly equal. You can take that and you know what with it!
Don't be patronizing.
"Whenever a person starts name calling or falsely judges a person, they lose credibility."
No, not always. This also depends on the other half of the conversation and what ignorant statement has been said. I'm really tired of people using this as a general all around win. Your ignorance keeps you from seeing that homosexuals are people too. And they love just as you heteros do. We are flesh and blood, emotions and feelings and we LOVE! That gives us every right to be MARRIED!
"First off, me stating the homosexual's were guilty of promoting special laws isn't predudicial"
THEY ARE NOT SPECIAL RIGHTS! THEY ARE EQUAL RIGHTS! To call them special rights is a prejudice statement. It is still making the claim that homosexuals are not as good as you and not deserving of your same right to be called MARRIED.
"homosexual's were guilty of promoting"
GUILTY?? You are judging!! I have not falsely judged you! You have proven my case that you are prejudice.
"A MINORITY group (whether 1 or 10% is still a minority) was not to change laws, but to create new equal rights laws."
Gotta love how you force the separation by use of all caps, "A MINORITY". It does not matter how many we are...EQUAL RIGHTS FOR ALL!! It's in the Constitution and it's in the bill of rights! Do you know how the DMA and DADT got passed? Because the government walked all over the US Constitution and the Bill of Rights! I'm going to laugh at all of you when they take rights away from you that matter! You let them start it by ignoring the rights of others. You made them! You made the government that will eventually walk all over your rights too.
"I disagree with the first part of the statement"
Until you face the day that you are drawn to the same sex and there's nothing you can do about it or until you see the day when you can force yourself not to be drawn to the opposite sex, then you can disagree with the fact HOMOSEXUALS ARE BORN TO BE HOMOSEXUALS but I can guarantee if there was ever such a time or day, you would not then disagree! GOD made us this way! Just like He made you straight or did you do that all on your own by denouncing your gay self????
"On the same note, there isn't any evidence that God allows homosexuals to be born that way."
The evidence is right smack dab in your face!! I EXIST! GOD ALLOWS ME TO BE BORN THIS WAY! If He did not allow it, I'd be DEAD already! MILLIONS OF PEOPLE! A billion if you count world wide! We're not making it up! I've been single by choice for 11 years now. I'm still a lesbian! I love a woman just as you love a woman. Same, same. Can you stop? I know I can't.
"However, there is plenty of evidence it occurs from a person's inability to correctly interpret natural human relationships, and is reinforced by, among other things, spiritual entities deluding their thinking with non stop propaganda."
And this works for anyone who has never been gay. This works to appease their minds. This is not the answer. But it works for those who just can't accept without a damn good reason. Sex with a man makes my stomach turn. Yes, when I was 18-20, I gave the hetero life a fair shake. I found sex with a man revolting and I actually liked the guy. He treated me like the most perfect person in the world and I cared very much for him. But the relationship and the sex was not natural for me! I just was not attracted to him that way even though I tried to make myself be. I've never found a man in all my 49 years that I just had to be with like I just have to be with a woman. I found my naturally correct relationship with women! When you heteros stop throwing away marriage for flings or stupid reason, then you heteros can preach proper relationships! Now be happy, I've had to spill my life out here for all the world to see. Feel good? Do you feel in control by making me share shit that should be personal to me just to make you see how WRONG you thinking is?? YES! Sanctimonious pompous people get me riled!
"it will be difficult for me to prove it to you without hours of sessions of explaining all of the complex details involved in how a person becomes a homosexual."
You are not gay! How can you possibly know what it's all about? What exactly does a know nothing about the life have as proof?? I am a lesbian! I know myself and I know what I feel and I know I've always felt this way! Out of 8 children, I am the only one who turned out gay! Where do my siblings who live the same way I did, grew up the same way I did, got beat the same way I did, where do my siblings fit in your grand scheme as to what MAKES a homosexual?? My parents took my sexuality better than you. They know I was born this way. They knew even before I knew! What the heck do you know about being gay? NOTHING! You can not read gay and know all about it, you must live it to understand it!
"and is quite provable and changing back to heterosexual is achievable to those who wish to be treated."
HOMOSEXUALITY IS NOT A SICKNESS!! IT IS NOT A DISEASE!! STUPIDITY IS! Go get treated. The only people who "go back straight" are people who were always straight! They just played on our side of the fence for the thrill. I'd like to smack them all for ever claiming to be gay. They WERE NOT!
After that last comment from you I am done. You're an old dying breed. You do not support my cause, you support your cause of separate and fairly equal. You can take that and you know what with it!
Well, believe it or not, I do feel sorry for you, and right now you are your own worst enemy. There is a fine line between anger and passion, and unfortunately you are allowing anger to control any compromise of rational thinking.
Being one of a large family is exactly one of the patterns I mentioned. And, yes I do know what homosexuals are all about. I've heard their pain, probably more than you have, and probably understand it more than you do.
Apparently at this point there isn't anything I can do for you from this media, but I do hope you can figure out a better way for you to communicate to people without assaulting them. Keep up the good work on advising others on their other issues. FF
Can I ask you one last question, and please don't answer it here. It is just for you to think about. How do you picture your dad when you were a child? Someone who you can snuggle up with and have him read you a story? Or someone who is smiling at you with a present in one hand, and a hidden hammer behind his back?
Being one of a large family is exactly one of the patterns I mentioned. And, yes I do know what homosexuals are all about. I've heard their pain, probably more than you have, and probably understand it more than you do.
Apparently at this point there isn't anything I can do for you from this media, but I do hope you can figure out a better way for you to communicate to people without assaulting them. Keep up the good work on advising others on their other issues. FF
Can I ask you one last question, and please don't answer it here. It is just for you to think about. How do you picture your dad when you were a child? Someone who you can snuggle up with and have him read you a story? Or someone who is smiling at you with a present in one hand, and a hidden hammer behind his back?
"I do feel sorry for you"
This statement is only made by a person who allows their ego to tell them they are superior. Feel sorry for yourself that you have trouble opening your mind to full equality.
"right now you are your own worst enemy. "
As are you if you think you are fooling anyone about your open mindedness.
"And, yes I do know what homosexuals are all about. "
You know what our struggle is about. You do not know what makes us gay, that's what you use to keep us only mildly equal. Because you DO NOT understand it. If you did, you would not be spouting the same tired old cliches about homosexuals. They can be cured??? NO! They can not be. I've seen those Christian cures. They are sickening what they put people through. Insidious mind melts! It's abusive! Have you ever seen the mental torture these people are subject too? THEY BREAK! That is not CURE!
"Apparently at this point there isn't anything I can do for you"
I do not need you to do anything for me. I am fine being a lesbian. I do not need your false cure. I have nothing to be cured of. I live as God intended me to live.
"but I do hope you can figure out a better way for you to communicate to people without assaulting them. "
Same back to you. I do hope you can find a way to communicate with homosexuals without assaulting them with the same tired outdated garbage that even the psychiatric and medical professionals have said are false beliefs about the homosexual life. When you assault people with false statements, expect to be assaulted back. Until you live being a homosexual, you can not even fathom what life is like when you face a wall of intolerance and prejudice with people who know nothing about your life telling you what your life is all about. You might hear my pain but you sure as heck don't feel it. Every time a false cliche is spouted about my life, it hurts. Feel good about yourself that you've forced me to admit even that. It's about time you people realized how your words hurt. DO NOT condemn me for firing back on you!
This statement is only made by a person who allows their ego to tell them they are superior. Feel sorry for yourself that you have trouble opening your mind to full equality.
"right now you are your own worst enemy. "
As are you if you think you are fooling anyone about your open mindedness.
"And, yes I do know what homosexuals are all about. "
You know what our struggle is about. You do not know what makes us gay, that's what you use to keep us only mildly equal. Because you DO NOT understand it. If you did, you would not be spouting the same tired old cliches about homosexuals. They can be cured??? NO! They can not be. I've seen those Christian cures. They are sickening what they put people through. Insidious mind melts! It's abusive! Have you ever seen the mental torture these people are subject too? THEY BREAK! That is not CURE!
"Apparently at this point there isn't anything I can do for you"
I do not need you to do anything for me. I am fine being a lesbian. I do not need your false cure. I have nothing to be cured of. I live as God intended me to live.
"but I do hope you can figure out a better way for you to communicate to people without assaulting them. "
Same back to you. I do hope you can find a way to communicate with homosexuals without assaulting them with the same tired outdated garbage that even the psychiatric and medical professionals have said are false beliefs about the homosexual life. When you assault people with false statements, expect to be assaulted back. Until you live being a homosexual, you can not even fathom what life is like when you face a wall of intolerance and prejudice with people who know nothing about your life telling you what your life is all about. You might hear my pain but you sure as heck don't feel it. Every time a false cliche is spouted about my life, it hurts. Feel good about yourself that you've forced me to admit even that. It's about time you people realized how your words hurt. DO NOT condemn me for firing back on you!
"How do you picture your dad when you were a child?"
My father has nothing to do with me being gay. All my siblings feel the same about him. Not one of the other 7 turned out gay. I am one of the stronger siblings, I forgave him a long time ago. He is dead now, if he even had a smidgen of influence over me as an adult, which he did not, that influence if it existed would be as gone as he is. I am still a lesbian. The rest of my siblings still have issues with him. They are still straight. So, your recipe on how to create a gay fails. My father supported me in my sexuality. He knocked a man out one day for speaking ill of homosexuals. Nothing in life made me gay. I knew when I was 5 I was different. There's a story that I'm not going to share right now because it's extra typing. My mother repeats the story to people who have trouble understanding that people are born gay. Short story, I knew I was different and told her so. I just didn't know why at the time. My parents knew when I was a young child I was different. As I grew, they figured it out way before I did. I was born to be a lesbian. God made me this way.
"Someone who you can snuggle up with and have him read you a story?"
My mother didn't even read us bedtime stories. We didn't need to be lulled to sleep. We were busy active children and when we went to bed, we fell asleep in minutes.
I could sit in his lap as a child and watch football with him. When I was too old for that, I sat next to him while we rooted on our favorite team together. Better than a bedtime story because we could interact.
I am not broken just because I'm a lesbian. You can not fix me judger because there's nothing to be fixed. You judge me as someone with a disease. You are wrong.
My father has nothing to do with me being gay. All my siblings feel the same about him. Not one of the other 7 turned out gay. I am one of the stronger siblings, I forgave him a long time ago. He is dead now, if he even had a smidgen of influence over me as an adult, which he did not, that influence if it existed would be as gone as he is. I am still a lesbian. The rest of my siblings still have issues with him. They are still straight. So, your recipe on how to create a gay fails. My father supported me in my sexuality. He knocked a man out one day for speaking ill of homosexuals. Nothing in life made me gay. I knew when I was 5 I was different. There's a story that I'm not going to share right now because it's extra typing. My mother repeats the story to people who have trouble understanding that people are born gay. Short story, I knew I was different and told her so. I just didn't know why at the time. My parents knew when I was a young child I was different. As I grew, they figured it out way before I did. I was born to be a lesbian. God made me this way.
"Someone who you can snuggle up with and have him read you a story?"
My mother didn't even read us bedtime stories. We didn't need to be lulled to sleep. We were busy active children and when we went to bed, we fell asleep in minutes.
I could sit in his lap as a child and watch football with him. When I was too old for that, I sat next to him while we rooted on our favorite team together. Better than a bedtime story because we could interact.
I am not broken just because I'm a lesbian. You can not fix me judger because there's nothing to be fixed. You judge me as someone with a disease. You are wrong.
How many other people on this forum have had to peel away their own skin to show what's inside them like I have all because of ignorance and intolerance? How are you being fair and loving as your God would want you to be by putting me on trial and forcing me to have to defend myself by showing my inner most being? What right do you have? What right does your book give you to do this to another one of God's creations? What right? Is this what you call showing your God's love? Keep it. That is not love, caring or compassion. It's standing above me and judging.
Apparently you didn't read the question because I asked you not to answer it, just think about it. And the result? Once again, you jump to false conclusions without having an ounce of fact or reason to my asking.
When I pay you a compliment, you distort it to patronizing. Whenever I mention my intent, you chew it up and spew it back with your own preconceived venom.
So, getting back to facts and reason. Homosexuality is a proven disorder. The fact that you don't agree doesn't make it true. It is curable, for those who take a chance and think for just a moment that it might be possibly true. And the facts are, people are getting set free from it. It is obvious you have no desire to even learn some of the reasons why a homosexual becomes one, to even just consider, so again, there is no point in pursuing this conversation. Apparently any guy who does this is automatically the enemy. So, that is another area that should be looked into. But again, it doesn't appear to be worth my time. I do have better things to do, such as help those who are interested in having their lives restored.
You mentioned about the horrible cure coming from people being broken. Yes, the cure is traumatic for anyone who discovers living a life of lies. Sometimes it takes years to recover from the delusion. I doubt that you would be able to deal with it at this time. Maybe some other time if you can find help with the uncontrolled anger, since it is obvious you couldn't trust me to assist you with that either.
I came back to see if the venom spewing had ended yet, and it obviously hasn't, but I can always hope and pray.
Good night again, dear Colleen.
When I pay you a compliment, you distort it to patronizing. Whenever I mention my intent, you chew it up and spew it back with your own preconceived venom.
So, getting back to facts and reason. Homosexuality is a proven disorder. The fact that you don't agree doesn't make it true. It is curable, for those who take a chance and think for just a moment that it might be possibly true. And the facts are, people are getting set free from it. It is obvious you have no desire to even learn some of the reasons why a homosexual becomes one, to even just consider, so again, there is no point in pursuing this conversation. Apparently any guy who does this is automatically the enemy. So, that is another area that should be looked into. But again, it doesn't appear to be worth my time. I do have better things to do, such as help those who are interested in having their lives restored.
You mentioned about the horrible cure coming from people being broken. Yes, the cure is traumatic for anyone who discovers living a life of lies. Sometimes it takes years to recover from the delusion. I doubt that you would be able to deal with it at this time. Maybe some other time if you can find help with the uncontrolled anger, since it is obvious you couldn't trust me to assist you with that either.
I came back to see if the venom spewing had ended yet, and it obviously hasn't, but I can always hope and pray.
Good night again, dear Colleen.
Oh, I read it. I just had no reason to think about it. I posted to let you know, I had no reason to think about it. My father has nothing to do with my sexuality. I'm 49 years old. Do you think I've never thought of my relationship with my father? Are you a make believe psychologist?
"Homosexuality is a proven disorder. The fact that you don't agree doesn't make it true. It is curable, for those who take a chance and think for just a moment that it might be possibly true. "
CHEW, CHEW, CHEW, SPIT!
Not according to the APA, the MDA and all true homosexuals. The only people who can be "cured" are the people who are not truly homosexual. Or the homosexual who puts his real self into a closet and then pretends to be straight to the glory of his abusers. But that is not a cure. You are not cured FF as much as you think you are.
I was going to respond to the rest of your close minded garbage but no. You make me sick. This is not because you are a guy either but because you're a close minded moron so full of yourself that you can't be any help to anyone. You have no right to believe you know anything about homosexuality unless you're a closet homo (which I suspect you are) pretending to be straight. Go heal a fake homo and be proud of yourself. How can you stand yourself, you pompous basement witch doctor? There is nothing to heal me from. You need to be healed of your arrogance and misguided information that you apparently got off some twisted Christian site or was indoctrinated into you during your "healing". You said all the right things to bring out my venom. Enjoy :)
Yes, I get angry when the likes of you come along and tell me I have a disease and you can cure me with your witch doctor voo-doo magic. You want to help me with my anger management? Get your nose out of my life and my bedroom! You and the rest of the loopy Christians who like to point out my anger when they attack me with their baseless accusations of being morally wrong and sick! You would be angry too you closet homosexual hypocrite if you weren't such a weakling giving into the fears of damnation heaped apon you by your abusing witch doctors who believe they are doing God's work. You'll be surprised come your next life when you realize, yup, your gay..again. You have to face it sometime. It's the lesson God gave you. It will keep repeating until you own it, live it and learn from it so you never again attack another and lord over them telling them they are sick and you have the cure! Witch doctor. You can't even cure yourself.
"Homosexuality is a proven disorder. The fact that you don't agree doesn't make it true. It is curable, for those who take a chance and think for just a moment that it might be possibly true. "
CHEW, CHEW, CHEW, SPIT!
Not according to the APA, the MDA and all true homosexuals. The only people who can be "cured" are the people who are not truly homosexual. Or the homosexual who puts his real self into a closet and then pretends to be straight to the glory of his abusers. But that is not a cure. You are not cured FF as much as you think you are.
I was going to respond to the rest of your close minded garbage but no. You make me sick. This is not because you are a guy either but because you're a close minded moron so full of yourself that you can't be any help to anyone. You have no right to believe you know anything about homosexuality unless you're a closet homo (which I suspect you are) pretending to be straight. Go heal a fake homo and be proud of yourself. How can you stand yourself, you pompous basement witch doctor? There is nothing to heal me from. You need to be healed of your arrogance and misguided information that you apparently got off some twisted Christian site or was indoctrinated into you during your "healing". You said all the right things to bring out my venom. Enjoy :)
Yes, I get angry when the likes of you come along and tell me I have a disease and you can cure me with your witch doctor voo-doo magic. You want to help me with my anger management? Get your nose out of my life and my bedroom! You and the rest of the loopy Christians who like to point out my anger when they attack me with their baseless accusations of being morally wrong and sick! You would be angry too you closet homosexual hypocrite if you weren't such a weakling giving into the fears of damnation heaped apon you by your abusing witch doctors who believe they are doing God's work. You'll be surprised come your next life when you realize, yup, your gay..again. You have to face it sometime. It's the lesson God gave you. It will keep repeating until you own it, live it and learn from it so you never again attack another and lord over them telling them they are sick and you have the cure! Witch doctor. You can't even cure yourself.
The discussion about this question has turned out to be a wannabe phychiatric nightmare. Freedom Fighter the advice you give would be better suited in keeping it to yourself. You continue in aggravating her when she doesn't want your advice. We are here to discuss issues, not to tell others how they should be living their lives. Our opinions are just that, they are our opinions. They should not be submitted with the intention of making another person feel inferior. Your beliefs on homosexuality are just that, YOUR beliefs, I personally don't agree with you. I don't believe you have the right to tell Colleen that she is sick and can be cured. You are not qualified to make these statements. You need to realize that this can be construed as a personal attack on Colleen. That will not be tolerated. To add fuel to the fire and continue this discussion is not advised. The questiion asked was "Are homosexuals guilty of discriminating against normally sexual people?" If they are, I can understand why just reading your answers on this thread.
Thank you 4dogs for your comments. Actually, I am one of a few people today that has the proven ability to help homosexuals, and others, to get set free of their enemy within. To make myself clear, it isn't me, but the healing power of the Holy Spirit that is restoring people to the lives He intended for them. I just lead the person to the healing waters, and the restoring begins if they choose to drink.
I am not sure why I thought it would be beneficial to attempt this over a public format. My mistake. Hope things turn out for the best for all. FF
I am not sure why I thought it would be beneficial to attempt this over a public format. My mistake. Hope things turn out for the best for all. FF
"I am not sure why I thought it would be beneficial to attempt this over a public format."
Could it have been your deluded sense of self?
Your overly inflated ego?
The fact you believe you died and then became an angle?
Are you in a padded room?
You're a religious quack and you and your ilk are the only enemies homosexuals have. I'm quite happy being a lesbian. Why don't you go find some happiness being what you were meant to be? You only do what you do because you can't beat what you view as a demon out of yourself so you instead try to do it to other people. You're the only one with a demon FF. Go take care of you and leave others be. Embrace your sexuality. Set your tortured Soul free. You'll never be truly happy unless you shed your fake straight persona. Take the hetero mask off and be free.
Oh and what your "healers" told you was water? Yeah, they lied. It's really Koolaid. Don't drink the Koolaid!
Could it have been your deluded sense of self?
Your overly inflated ego?
The fact you believe you died and then became an angle?
Are you in a padded room?
You're a religious quack and you and your ilk are the only enemies homosexuals have. I'm quite happy being a lesbian. Why don't you go find some happiness being what you were meant to be? You only do what you do because you can't beat what you view as a demon out of yourself so you instead try to do it to other people. You're the only one with a demon FF. Go take care of you and leave others be. Embrace your sexuality. Set your tortured Soul free. You'll never be truly happy unless you shed your fake straight persona. Take the hetero mask off and be free.
Oh and what your "healers" told you was water? Yeah, they lied. It's really Koolaid. Don't drink the Koolaid!
Freedom Fighter do you not understand a word that I was saying? I said stop with the rhetoric. As far as I am concerned at this moment, the only ability you have is putting your foot up your butt. You are overstepping the boundaries of free speech as believed in this forum. One more word from you on this subject whether here or another thread and I will have to suspend you. Consider yourself warned.
No worries dear. I've decided to leave the site. Sorry you didn't get a chance to learn from the best. If somehow you decide to change your mind, here is an organization I consult for at times. They are called NARTH, and are very good. http://narth.com/menus/myths.html
Best wishes colleen, oh and you two 4dogs. Congratulations on your new self appointed thought police role. FF
Best wishes colleen, oh and you two 4dogs. Congratulations on your new self appointed thought police role. FF
Isn't DARTH a character in Star Wars? Do you have your very own spaceship too? Never mind, your over inflated ego should work just fine, if not, you always have your angel wings. Happy travels. ;)
PEOPLELOVER
Right let`s get this sorted the question to me clearly asks "Are homosexuals guilty of discriminating AGAINST normaly sexual people?" Can we agree that is what was asked?
Can we also agree that nothing was asked as to marriage, anal sex or the whole host of things that have been brought up?
I agree what is normal to one person is a bit iffy to another, but that does not make it normal or abnormal.
To be abnormal I would have to engage in sex standing on my head in a hammock with my hands tied behind my back. Not only abnormal but bloody difficult.
We as human beings have a fear of the unknown and that extends to sexual actities.
My answer is quite simply people of a different sexual persuasuion can and are discriminatory against those with a different orientation.
So YES homosexual people CAN be, but not necessarily all are,capable of discrimination as are hetrosexual but again not all are.
Sorry folks but we achieve little with a tirade of words that only strenghten the resolve of one group against others.
Grandad has spoken so play nicely or go to bed.
Colleen
PEOPLELOVER
Colleen
Can we also agree that nothing was asked as to marriage, anal sex or the whole host of things that have been brought up?
I agree what is normal to one person is a bit iffy to another, but that does not make it normal or abnormal.
To be abnormal I would have to engage in sex standing on my head in a hammock with my hands tied behind my back. Not only abnormal but bloody difficult.
We as human beings have a fear of the unknown and that extends to sexual actities.
My answer is quite simply people of a different sexual persuasuion can and are discriminatory against those with a different orientation.
So YES homosexual people CAN be, but not necessarily all are,capable of discrimination as are hetrosexual but again not all are.
Sorry folks but we achieve little with a tirade of words that only strenghten the resolve of one group against others.
Grandad has spoken so play nicely or go to bed.
| 13 years ago. Rating: 7 | |
Would you happen to know what the discrimination are against heterosexuals? I really want to know what they are because if they are unfair, I will fight against them too.
Colleen I respect you as a fellow human being and regard you as a friend and if friends cannot speak honestly to one another then they are not truely friends.
You yourself complain that hetros do not understand and so discriminate against homosexuals which in its self is you discriminating against hetros.
As I said not ALL do but All are capable of discrimination irrespective of their beliefs or activities.
For myself I don`t give a toss what people do in private and frankly it annoys me no end to see this subject battered almost to death here.
Let anyone marry who they love I don`t give a stuff. If same sex marry and one dies then the remaining one should have all the entitlements of a opposite sex couple. I believe eventualy it will come but not by chest beating on the part of either side. Calm sensible discussion will solve problems. Shouting will not.
What is that old cliche? "The first one to raise their voice has lost the arguement"
Disagree with your strong comments but still love you.xx
This is further evidenced by the fact I have not and will not respond to the other "shouters" on this question.
You yourself complain that hetros do not understand and so discriminate against homosexuals which in its self is you discriminating against hetros.
As I said not ALL do but All are capable of discrimination irrespective of their beliefs or activities.
For myself I don`t give a toss what people do in private and frankly it annoys me no end to see this subject battered almost to death here.
Let anyone marry who they love I don`t give a stuff. If same sex marry and one dies then the remaining one should have all the entitlements of a opposite sex couple. I believe eventualy it will come but not by chest beating on the part of either side. Calm sensible discussion will solve problems. Shouting will not.
What is that old cliche? "The first one to raise their voice has lost the arguement"
Disagree with your strong comments but still love you.xx
This is further evidenced by the fact I have not and will not respond to the other "shouters" on this question.
Then we differ in our views of discrimination. Discrimination to me is based on withholding rights from another group just because they are not like you. Unfair treatment by denying equal civil rights.
I do not see me standing up against having my rights kept from me as being discriminatory against heteros by whatever makes you happiest in you analogy, i leave you with it.
I do not see me standing up against having my rights kept from me as being discriminatory against heteros by whatever makes you happiest in you analogy, i leave you with it.
robertgrist
When I first tasted ice cream as a child, I did not like it because it was cold….it took a little getting use to. I think of those who argue against gays as un-self-realized gays. To me they are fighting the greatest enemy on earth…themselves. I cannot imagine being against love. That’s like opposing your own life. I am a man and I prefer the company of women, not that I am opposed to the company of men as I have many male friends. I have gay friends but we have no sex, we are friends. Do you have to fit everything in the world into some organization of similes? For this and against that obsessively…their must be a psycho-barb name for that. I wonder if there is therapy for that?
| 13 years ago. Rating: 6 | |
Jenn
6dogs4us
If people had been treating me like a second class citizen for most of my life, I might tend to treat heterosexuals the same way in retaliation. I truly believe that the only thing all homosexuals are asking is that they are treated as equals by heterosexual society, no more, no less. They are not guilty of discrimination in any way, shape or manner. Society needs to take a long hard look at how we treat our fellow human beings. It's time to tear down the barriers, time to accept everyone and treat them with the respect they deserve.
| 13 years ago. Rating: 6 | |
daren1
dad59
The only thing their asking for is the same EQUALITIES and RECOGNITION as all humans deserve, NO MORE, NO LESS. THOU SHALL NOT JUDGE!!
| 13 years ago. Rating: 5 | |
Actually, thou shalt judge. It is an adult facility. We need to make all sorts of judgments. I take it the 'thou shalt' is to put some biblical authority to a mendacity. The actual phrase was "Judge not that you should be so judged". That is to say, do not be unfair or unmerciful in your judgments or you just might suffer the same from God!!
So is it your position that one should be judged for the way one is born and had NO voice in it, because then it becomes discriminatory based. Do you also judge base on RACE, RELIGION, DISABILITY, ETC.!!! The #1 reason most have problems with it is FEAR!
Go dad59!
amfortas, do you not agree that in order to hold prejudice against another, that is the same as judging, something the bible instructs not to do?
amfortas, do you not agree that in order to hold prejudice against another, that is the same as judging, something the bible instructs not to do?
Chiangmai
amfortas, by asking this question, I don't think you're being insensitive. Perhaps a little naive. Let's rephrase your question by asking whether it's possible for members of a minority group to discriminate against members of another group with a larger number. The answer, to me, is yes as discrimination is defined below:
"treatment or consideration of, or making a distinction in favor of or against, a person or thing based on the group, class, or category to which that person or thing belongs rather than on individual merit; racial and religious intolerance and discrimination."
With regard to discrimination, size of the particular group doesn't matter. Attitude and action do.
| 13 years ago. Rating: 2 | |
So please do tell me how the heterosexuals are being discriminated against? What civil rights are being denied them by the homosexuals? No, amfortas put out the question exactly as it was meant to be. A discriminatory slam on the homosexuals. Note the wording of normally-sexuals.
I stand corrected. I took the question to be whether it's possible for some homosexuals to discriminate against heterosexuals. It's possible, by definition, but improbable.
itsmee
this discussion of gay vs. straight sex seems to be the most popular topic for a cross section of people here on akaqa. i had an emotional relationship with a girl years go. i had a family and she was free and eleven years younger than me. i'd been raised in a small town in the mountains and i didn't know about it. when i found out i came derailed. she did too. as we drove out of town with our furniture and our kids i heard the song vincent by don mclean playing on the radio. i was half crazy and thought the song was for me. the words fit perfectly because we were both playing artist with our crayons ...
for awhile I thought i was gay and had a problem with being married. the feeling passed for all but one. and to this day ... well ... nevermind.
| 13 years ago. Rating: 2 | |
dwayne1716
like most minorities some have a chip on thier shoulder. Any body who wants to limit the freedom of another american citizen because of what they do in the privacy of there home does not have a good grasp of what this country is all about. we must not separation of church and state only when it goes along with are chritian beliefs it has to apply to all people all the time. to think that a young gay soldier could lose a leg fighting for this country and return home and not be able to marry anybody the want is absurb
| 13 years ago. Rating: 2 | |
"like most minorities some have a chip on thier shoulder."
Some fight bigotry on an almost daily basis. Sort of explains the chip if there must be one according to you.
Countering to you.
Some have a chip on their shoulder because others will not accept their idea of God.
Some fight bigotry on an almost daily basis. Sort of explains the chip if there must be one according to you.
Countering to you.
Some have a chip on their shoulder because others will not accept their idea of God.
If you thought in your heart of hearts that a friend was in danger but did not know it would you do nothing. I wish I would not have told you I was praying for you kept it private like Im supposed to. but its out there now can we move on.I said some have a chip not all not you.just like the other question active now about obama its not about race its about the future of this country.
I'd let them stay their course if they told me more than once their way was the way for them. I have no right to impede on anothers destiny or how they view their creator. There was no reason for you to start your comment like you did. It in no way referred to the question. We have never asked to have any heterosexual rights removed, like prop 8 did to the homosexuals, nor have we ever asked to disallow any rights to heterosexuals. Having a chip on ones shoulder has nothing to do with any of that.
thats the way i interpreted the question.i truly did not mean it in a bad way just prefacing my answer.the question seem to be finding fault with gays i was stating what i feel to be a fact then supporting the rights of every us citizen the pursuit of happiness
FreedomFighter
kidder
eggplant
amfortas
Deathboy
i am a normal boy who loves girls but i love homosexuals even more lez not gay only lez cos you get 2 girls for the price of 1 healthy profit hehe xxx
| 13 years ago. Rating: 0 | |
colleen i know 2 les and i can get em in bed easy just trick em then they go and bam there yours if they wont it cos i'm not raper
You say trick them into your bed. In order to "trick" a lesbian into your bed, you would have to drug here. Try to understand this stud, no matter now studdly you think you are, lesbians are not attracted to men and most especially not the ugly thing between their legs and yes, it's ugly, sorry to break it to you. Now if you have to drug them, and then you touch them anywhere sexual, that is rape. If you have to trick them into your bed, then studdly, that is a clear sign they have no wish to have sex with you.
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